“Admit your distant love affair is with yourself.”
-David Whyte
It’s deeply ingrained in us to dream about what we want to have, do, and achieve.
But this future-oriented, external focus often distracts us from our most important inner values.
Our fixation with the superficial aspects of our wellbeing interferes with the most important question we all face: who we want to be.
Who we are determines the quality and course of our lives far more than what we do.
But most of us live in such a way that reveals a deep error in our understanding of the nature of wellbeing.
Consciously or unconsciously, we believe our internal peace is reliant upon our external circumstances lining up just so in order to feel okay.
But the truth is, when we do the deep inner healing work of authentic transformation, our internal state becomes less and less tied to what is happening externally.
That doesn’t mean we are impervious to life’s difficulties.
No one is.
It just means we learn to interact with those difficulties in ways that allow us to transcend them and increasingly expand our strength, resilience, and conscious awareness.
In other words, we learn to surf the waves of life with more and more ease and grace.
And as we do so, we begin to discover joy, laughter, and play even in the midst of deeply challenging and painful circumstances.
Not only that, but when we cultivate a robust sense of internal wellbeing, it actually has a powerful influence on how our lives unfold externally.
In other words, we have it all backwards.
We believe our inner salvation lies in the external world, when in reality our external lives usually begin to change in substantive and sustainable ways only when we’ve done the deep inner work.
The more we tend to our inner wellbeing and who we are, the more we bring our outer lives into alignment with what our souls are calling forth from us.
Put another way, we have to refocus our time, energy, and attention toward the cultivation of being in order to reconnect with our souls, our higher purpose, and our sense of vitality.
This is how we begin to live out our unique destinies in the world.
Doing deep transformational work is the only way to cultivate a robust and lasting sense of internal peace.
Anything else is just a superficial fix.
So when you live under the illusion that peace is primarily external you’re always waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Because you’re only okay if your external circumstances are lining up how you hope (which they rarely do).
That’s the irony.
When we worship the external, things never seem to line up how we want.
But when we center our wellness internally, things tend to shift externally and fall into place more and more seamlessly.
And we see how all of it serves our growth and expansion, deepening our inner strength and capacity.
Becoming who we want to be is a lifelong undertaking.
It requires us to practice attuning our attention to what our souls most deeply value and to increasingly live out and embody the values that are most essential to our being.
Aligning our lives in this way is at the heart of cultivating character and integrity.
This takes courage, strength, and a willingness to look honestly at ourselves, our flaws, and what is not working in our lives.
It’s not easy to look at what is painful about our lives and to make the necessary changes.
But it is worth it.
For me personally, realigning my life to reflect my values means setting aside more time to nurture my creativity, which is an essential element of my spiritual life and nourishes my ability to be more present, resilient, and kind.
And that’s what our podcast episode this week is all about.
My guest Micheal o Suilleabhain is an Irish poet and singer, spiritual guide, performance artist, and collaborator with one of my personal heroes, David Whyte.
Micheal and I discuss artistic virtuosity, creative self-expression, artistic vulnerability, inner conflicts in performance, and creativity as a spiritual and transformational practice serving our internal evolution.
Micheal is a lovely soul and shares some beautiful gems of poetry on this show so you won’t want to miss it.
Check it out here:
Let us know what you think, and don’t hesitate to reach out if there’s anything we can do to help on your creative, spiritual, or transformational journey.
Listen to this podcast on:
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learning to love the sound of your own voice is almost a taboo subject really
0:06
and I did that early mercifully for myself I must have known that the walls
0:12
were closing in on all other aspects of my of my psyche and I said what can I
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what do I have here you know what what can I learn what can I love in myself and I knew I could just about sing and I
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knew I could drum so I was like you know what I’m going to stop the rot here I’m just going to love it that’s it I’m just
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gonna love it and uh and I learned to love the sound of my own voice and I learned to make music when I was alone
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and that just speaks for itself and the poem is called early music
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just brings us to a place which we can all recognize in ourselves
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[Music]
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hello and welcome to waking up with Brook sprawl my guest today is the wonderful Michal O Sullivan behal
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welcome hello everybody hello from County Clare in Ireland yes I’ve met mihal uh
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traveling with David White in Italy this summer and we had a beautiful time playing music and writing poetry and
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walking for Miles along the Italian landscape and Michal is just a beautiful
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soul an incredible poet an incredible vocalist as well and so I wanted to to
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connect and see um see what see what emerges in our conversation today
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um Paul talk to me about your work as a poet and a vocalist and how that
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connects with your spiritual practice and spirituality ah thanks so much yeah well where we met one of the unexpected
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turns that my vocation as a musician I started as a drummer which is a an
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archetypal thing I suppose and uh then ran to the front of the stage and became a singer uh all sorts of singing and
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cheap tricks I was uh guilty of doing on stage and um became quite virtuosic and
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quite funny actually and um humor has been a a
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a definite element of my journey uh both the the
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honing of The Craft of comedy and humor and then also trying to uh smooth out
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its virtuosity in my life as well and one of the unexpected turns uh where we
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met as a guide which is very much the physically taking people places you know
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of course uh being a singer I was very struck early on coming from a drumming
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background and noticing people dropping down into another space when a rhythm would be put
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forward but when one sings acapella as it is an Italian but um when it’s
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unaccompanied when one sings the solo voice people drop into a reverie uh
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almost immediately it’s a very powerful thing and it for me for a long time
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um keeping my eyes closed was the only option when I would sing uh or I would
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or I would get quite emotional actually if I met eyes with people I would get very very emotional very quickly and the
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same thing happened when I first started reading poetry as well I would have to keep my
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eyes closed but there Comes A Time Of course when one has to open their eyes and show their virtuosity you know overhear
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themselves and my spiritual practice around around performance of music and
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poetry is still happening to be honest I feel like I was asleep a lot of my life like many of us I woke up I’m now 38
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years old that has been a great thing when I opened my eyes again and
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overheard myself of course in Psychotherapy you’re supposed to overhear yourself but yesterday I was
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working with a person online in these poetry conversations that I have and
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they were working with a performance coach this is just yesterday and the performance coach asked that person do
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you hear yourself when you speak and that really struck me you know because performance is the art of
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hearing yourself speak of course and speaking and and all life but also there’s a an element where you’re
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supposed to let things flow and enter into a flow State and that then is letting go of of listening to yourself
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so you’re not supposed to do more of either um so you you yourself enter into a kind
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of a reverie I suppose and music and poetry has always brought me into a ritual Space Music especially and then
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David quite my collaboration with him I see it as a ritual space as well really
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in a literary sense but uh so I was always uncomfortable being in in a
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spiritual place but always had the currency of it
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so it left me feeling like a fraud actually for many many years and that I was unworthy that I was that I was a
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singer I I hadn’t of course like most of our blockages I hadn’t articulated this to myself yet but um
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I just felt all the more like I was singing beautifully but I wasn’t walking the walk you know I was um I was like a
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hedonist like most people in their 20s I was just a hedonist and um quite negative and cheap laughs and I
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wasn’t dropping down to that to that level I was singing at you know so that’s a long answer to to to the
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spirituality my relationship to the spirituality of my creation that’s where you’re supposed to be uncomfortable you
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know what you shared about um closing your eyes I relate to that as
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a singer um you know there’s something around this vulnerable expression and uh
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outward expression where you’re simultaneously wanting to be seen and then not wanting to be seen in your
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vulnerability in your expression and so that is part of the struggle of an artist who’s who’s kind of birthing
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their own voice and their own expression so I very much relate to that as well as
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you know the the heaviness and the depth of what we bring forth as artists
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there’s a tremendous weight to it and it becomes very
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um yeah that vulnerability is is is heavy
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the flip side of course is artists who kind of love themselves a little bit too much which is which is a marginally more
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repulsive than than one who’s too apologetic in fact I have a poem I I have one
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collection of poetry and there is a poem about just this thing actually it’s called the virtuoso
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and um I’ve always just loved the idea of when I was a kid there was a very famous
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violinist called Paganini an Italian virtuoso on the on the violin and they they said that he sold his soul to the
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devil to have to to have this skill at vile violent and he would play for
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thousands of people and as a kid I was always like but his soul is sold for the devil for a beautiful art form you know
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and they often say that about virtuosas or or that or about those those brilliant that they must have done a
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deal um a short-term deal you know with a long-term price to pay
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and uh that really set me off and I remember I must have been very very young when I heard that uh the tale of
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classical music of course but uh another thing that I suffered from as well a lot of my life is a belief in like the
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Excellence of my craft or or the spiritual nature of it but just these um
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uh unconscious apologies would come from my mouth before or or uh when you
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cheapen an experience which my mother never did and my father used to often read poetry before he’d
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play piano um as it’s kind of a setting as a way of bringing it
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um and it’s a good way of stopping yourself making a joke or something and
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um the poem is called the virtuoso are dedicated to all of us waking up here and it goes I don’t care if you’re sorry
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I don’t care if you’re sorry nor do you even anymore why a tone for your gifts
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Express remorse for your ability begging pardon in public
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be Instead The unrepentant Virtue also for you choose to stand showing us the
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spirit stir then fill and overflow within you the spirit does not ask forgiveness nor
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permission and upon your stage you can do no wrong get out of the way we love what you have
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and need no reminder of our sentence here on Earth please just set us free
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I love that get out of the way getting out of the way really struck me because what I think is true authentic art and
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writing is is really becoming a sort of channel for spirit and quite often we can’t even explain where we’re getting
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our ideas where the source is when I was in Italy with you all it was like poems were just channeling
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through me I didn’t even know where they were coming from and typically it’ll take me years to write a poem and rewrite and edit it and it was like I
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was writing these you know first drafts that were you know only needed a few minor tweaks it was like they were just
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gifted to me from above it didn’t feel like I was writing them and and that you
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know for me is is a really powerful spiritual expression is when the artist
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was through us and it’s really just a matter of getting our own ego out of the way
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the the element of permission around creativity is is is very close to my
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heart you know that and I found that working with my collection of poetry
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there’s a section in it under mythology and coming from Ireland
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we have such a rich mythology it’s not as well uh recorded as Greek or Roman uh
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stories so in Irish mythology you kind of have Gods like enter stage left of random stories to kind of come in and
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out and nobody knows why or what the relationships are or anything and then later of course you have St Patrick
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coming in and saving our gods and the Gods coming in and saving Saint Patrick and all of this type of thing a big uh
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overlap but uh I found that working with mythology as a poet you know there’s
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part of our um part of our uh
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art form is to work with shared archetypal Energies and then mythology you know one one has
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to have a strand of that in one’s own poetry if one is to you know pursue the craft at least privately and it’s just
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great material you know you don’t need to do much uh you don’t need to do much uh Research into a certain God or a
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certain story to to write a good old poem and to see your own reflection in it
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so it’s very popular as material but in in Ireland I was suffering from a serious lack of of a permissive uh
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essence you know um in Ireland like we we work with mythology in kindergarten and early
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um primary school or or or first level school when we’re kids and then there’s a there’s a large gap and then of course
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you’re supposed to do it in third level so or even a PhD level you know you have to
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choose it and um so it’s kind of like an infantilized the mythology or else it’s
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institutionalized and there’s no ownership between it and and I don’t know why that is I mean in Ireland we we
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have this thing called post colonialism where you’re like getting over the trauma of being taken over or colonized
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you could blame it on that that we’re we infantilized the beautiful archetypes in our own culture but I don’t know why it
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is either maybe the Catholic Church you know they were so influential in our education system for so long that you
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know it was it’s seen as um risque like a lot of it once you dig beneath the surface of any mythological Canon
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there’s a lot of a lot of hot and steamy stuff going on and um so
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it I I was coming to poetry as an adult looking for that permission to work with with mythology and uh and found it very
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challenging and uh so yes I I know what you mean and after a while the Damned the soul Dam burst uh
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and I got a few poems out of it but it took me a lot of work yeah it took me a lot of work so but that permission you
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felt in Italy yes and this podcast came out of that um you were feeling more than than just
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the poetic Muse uh it was a whole new chapter opening up for you around then yeah what
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you said earlier about this tension between hearing yourself and not hearing yourself in these artistic spaces I
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think is so profound because there is a simultaneous need for to Bear witness to
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one’s own gifts and voice while also not then identifying and it becoming an ego
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expression and so there’s I noticed for me sometimes I’ll be singing even in the
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privacy of my own home and my voice will do something it hasn’t done before it’ll open up in such a way and then I
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immediately am like oh it’s doing this thing and I and I’m I’ve got so excited and then it goes away it’s like this
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feeling of like you said it so beautifully this kind of flowing uh this
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ability to like to hold the structure of it while also flowing and I think that’s a really powerful way to talk about this
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art form I love what you said about your own voice and listening and overhearing it and
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there is a poem the flagship poem the title poem of my collection is about that one of the premises of those
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songs of Life sessions is that we create a repertoire of songs that we sing when we’re on our own
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so that we can own these songs they’re not party pieces they’re not necessarily to be performed for anybody
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and that’s been a great friend to me over the years is to create these Little Gems that have committed to memory that
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you can work work on yourself learning to love the sound of your own voice is
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almost a taboo subject really and I did that early mercifully for myself I must
14:48
have known that the walls were closing in on all other aspects of my of my
14:54
psyche and I said what can I what do I have here you know what what can I learn
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or what can I love in myself and I knew I could just about sing and I knew I could drum so I was like you know what
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I’m going to stop the rot here I’m just going to love it that’s it I’m just gonna love it and uh and I learned to
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love the sound of my own voice and I learned to make music when I was alone and that just speaks for itself and the
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poem is called early music just brings us to a place which we can all recognize in ourselves
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for I learned to make music when I was alone revering the moment before I began
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to sing then break the solitary silence I learned to love my own voice
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making a fountain pen to master the Phantom language each Brandenburg Concerto turned up loud furrowing ground
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while my father drilled his impossibly strong fingers on the steering wheel
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careening the back roads of bird Hill my mother would sing alone for hours
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Hildegard and shanos seamlessly sung light would stream in the sash window
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while she scribbled illegibly preparing for a performance
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I would drum my hands on my thighs until they were hot and red
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repeating the same beat thousands of times honing the same phrase
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and in the evening we would gather around two candles and early music on
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cassette an instrumental combination to unlock
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conversation and make the silences dance like Candlelight
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no vocal music to deflect or distract from a small family huddled around only
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food and Flame and the warm faint sound of God’s string
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a family that feels safe is sacred Echo soundings still bounce back
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reflected in the sound of early music
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what comes up for me is this feeling that as artists we’re constantly transmuting the ordinary into
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um we’re constantly kind of Fanning the ordinary daily into this flame of
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the miraculous and the Magical and there’s an attention that needs to be
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paid to the present moment and the mundane in order to find the Portal into the
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otherness of the world and I find myself as someone who’s equally artistically
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inclined as I am sort of entrepreneurial I’m constantly
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um kind of pulled between the part of me that wants to move really fast and
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Achieve and get things done and the part of me that wants to slow down and connect with this spiritual and artistic
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sentiment and it’s easier for me to be in the part of me that is busy and
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productive and achieving it’s more comfortable and it’s not vulnerable and there’s a motivation and there’s even an
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addiction in it sometimes but I’m finding that while I don’t want
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to give that part of me up I’m wanting to put it in equal balance with the
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spiritual and artistic part because really at the end of the day what makes life worth living is not what we achieve
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it’s how we relate to each day and each moment and so I’ve been really trying to
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find a balance between um in a way the present and future you
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know the ability to hold future dreams and goals as inspiration without
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overriding my my presence and my ability to connect with the beauty of what is
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ordinary in a day one of my favorite quotes from one of David’s poems is alertness is the hidden discipline of
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familiarity alertness is the hidden discipline of familiarity because that is exactly what it is and
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Henry who we’ve talked about Henry shookman um in one of his meditations he talks
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about this illusion that um the illusion that we’ve lived any moment
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before and this idea that actually each moment is so wholly new uh in one of my
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poems I say something like this moment is totally new and wholly yours or something like that there’s this idea of
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the born newness of now and um we forget and that’s why
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Awakening is often posited as a remembrance because there is actually a
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diligent attention and discipline in Remembering our spiritual nature and
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recovering the magic of the world that I think is Central to the artist’s kind of
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task in life we have to see ourselves as yeah the virtual so that we can make
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there has to be a new touchdown it earlier and it’s a I suppose it’s one of the characteristics the Cardinal
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characteristics of mania isn’t it like that we have to have both
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um a huge ego and a and a overly huge humility at the same time and insecurity
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and this um this this narcissism playing after each other I mean why else would I
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be here trying to learn anything to perform for anyone if not for
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self-gratification on some levels but it’s mostly thankfully
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um because I’ve seen it work um it’s hard to believe how powerful one-speaking voice is
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uh even even an imperfect one um if one has any level of of virtuosity
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or confidence and that virtuosity for me is not an Excellence not a Paganini like scales up and down it’s just simply an
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not not apologizing you know um so it is it’s a very much a
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discipline but it’s a it’s also unfortunate it’s like a family business if you don’t see it if you don’t see it
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being done you know it’s very difficult to master it’s a craft you know I so relate to the apologizing for your art
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um when I was really involved in the Poetry scene and reading around town the
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feedback that I would continually get is that I read my poems so quickly and as I look back it was like I was I almost was
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hoping no one would hear what I say it was like I was hoping that no one that I
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wouldn’t really be exposed in my vulnerability by uh moving so quickly
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and saying the poem so rapidly um there was a there was a mask there you know there’s an unconscious defense
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mechanism of okay here I am on stage wanting to be heard in one way and also
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in another way just you know don’t look here you know it’s really interesting this this tension that we have as
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artists yes and you know one can one can send out loving kindness and one can
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also just send out a bit of narcissistic kindness as well because if the more you
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believe you’re on the right path and believe in in the poems ironically it’s like it’s like a con it
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kind of it’s It’s a con actually which comes from the word confidence I I didn’t know that Therese but you you
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give people confidence in you and you do that by by fooling them and therefore you’re doing it by fooling yourself so
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it’s it’s it does have that element but it’s it’s it’s a light it’s light work
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you know um you have to Kindle in in yourself and your intentions are hopefully hopefully
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pretty pretty pretty positive you know um so in that sense so that belief in
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the path you’re on and if you are a performer or a missed mystified by by
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your own profession as well of of psychotherapy if that’s what you like to call it and um and the Art of listening
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and holding Secrets um for for for your life that belief in
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your own vocation is essential for I think Psychotherapy or more performative vocations as well and what comes to mind
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is a poem I recently committed to memory but I found I saw people perform with my
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mother throughout my childhood and it’s a translation of a
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mirabai poem and mirabai was an Indian princess and she uh there’s lots of
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stories written about her because she left the confines of the Royal Palace and she went off in a group of spiritual
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abandons and hit the road and traveled around living the life of a
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um a traveling spiritual you know Footloose person bringing great
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shame upon her family because she was married to a prince who died and as the
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tradition was at the time a woman was supposed to throw herself on the funeral pyre of that man but mirabai refused and
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left the palace half half banished but she was making a show of the family anyway out on the the hollow lands and
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hillylands of India and her brothers were sent out to bring her back
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and this is a translation of of that one of the many
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um vignettes of mirabai in the Indian tradition and translation by
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Robert Bly called why Mira can’t go back to her old
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home the colors of the Dark One have penetrated Mira’s body all other colors washed out
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making love with the dark one and eating little these are my pearls and my carnelians chanting beads in the
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forehead streak these are my scarves and my rings that’s enough feminine wiles for me
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my teacher taught me this approve me or disapprove me I follow the Mountain Energy day and night I take the path
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that ecstatic human beings have taken for centuries I do not hit anyone I Hurt No One what will you charge me with
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I have felt the swaying of the elephant’s shoulders and now you want me to climb on a jackass
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try to be serious yeah there’s a transportation that happens with this work where there’s
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something so visual it’s almost like a past life regression or something you’re stepping into this experience as this
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other being with its own imagery and and memories that’s really powerful
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I think I’ve always uh as a as a result of insecurity physical
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insecurity I suppose um always felt the reaction of people to be uh incongruous
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with what I was putting out you know like people often in a lot of ways My Life
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um feels like uh I’m more inclined to believe that no one
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else exists and like this is just my imagination because sometimes people like even when I was a kid as well I’d
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say something I’m like a whole room would laugh and like I wouldn’t know why you know like I think that happened to
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me marginally more than kids you know happens happens to every kid but and I I do find that people
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there’s something else does does come through and uh that people’s reactions to songs and poems and uh I would be
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inclined to believe that there’s something a multi-dimensional going on yeah yeah I don’t know why that is
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though that’s how poetry feels for me too when I’m writing and it reminds me of a poem by T.S Eliot I can’t remember
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what it’s called it’s something about magi the Journey of the Magi I believe and when I read that poem first it was
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like I’ve been there I’ve seen that there was something it wasn’t those specifics but it was the um experiential
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quality of the poem of the journey uh that felt very familiar in its
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eccentricities and strangeness um and there was something about that
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um that kind of writing that does feel like a genuine Transportation I also
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think about that with roomie’s work you know just there’s something about it that takes me somewhere where else that
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still feels familiar but doesn’t feel like it’s of me there is a very physical sense of the esoteric
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power of of singing if if if one believes in one’s virtuosity or the the
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craft I suppose seeing David white as well like the first time I saw him speak I didn’t know
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that a person could do that you know I had seen poetry recited but I had never
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gone into the reverie around somebody speaking in such an interdisciplinary level I often say that I grew up with
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two academic parents and outside of the scaffolding of an institution of
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Academia or musicology or uh or a concert you know the scaffolding of a musical
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performance I had never I had been to poetry readings but never never ones without notes never ones without a
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podium never ones with and David is an interesting and virtuosic performer of
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the ages and when he stands on stage he doesn’t move his feet he
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won’t move his feet for the whole session so maybe when he tells a joke sometimes he’ll Shuffle because the energy breaks but then once
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he finds his feet again he’ll just speak until to the next guy probably
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so I learned a lot from that and The Virtue also as well speaks about
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his influence over me has been Monumental of course and um The Virtue also speaks first is you who chooses to
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show the spirit stir then fill and overflow within you
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and in a sense that line is dedicated to him but also that moment when we’re on stage in silence when we’re holding a
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Silence of course in your vocation too holding silence can be just so healing and how do you read how long
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the Silence has gone on and David my brother asked that to David once in
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private and he said well actually when I do find a silence come to me and sometimes it can come to me in the
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middle of a poem he’ll just leave it um that he will imagine a vessel of water
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filling up um you know with it with the drips or a small stream of water and when that
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vessel begins to overflow when he can feel it uh breach then he’ll begin speaking again
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and I’ve I’ve seen him hold silences for right I’d say I’d say maybe
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between two and three minutes which is a long long time you know the the belief in the virtuosity of art
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conquering all you know um and the idea of Excellence is is um
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not even Excellence just just faith in the process you know we all go
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through chapters of our life where we get exhausted of ourselves and we take down the we kick down the
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walls of our of our identity you know and um art can both suspend our disbelief and
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you know speed up our mental breakdowns as well as depending on how we walk in I
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often say me hanging around with David white or all of the the um I suppose all
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of the on the other end of the spectrum all of the the Hollywood kind of celebs as well it just sped up my kind of
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breakdown I figure I have like a duty to my peers because I figure that I had I’m
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I’m I did what they’re going to be in five years you know so my David did me a
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favor the Poetry did me the favor of inducing my uh my my wake up you know
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there’s an acceleration of the process of uh dying and and entering into this
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new paradigm so seeing how people reinvent themselves through poetry and come to the well in
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transition parts of their life made me realize how how incendiary
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um to the self that the work is you know and uh David White is is very strong I feel in
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almost every facet of his psyche you know and that’s why he’s been able to keep going and um and I hope to get that
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strong one day you know to to be a touring like that bulletproof touring
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artist when I look at those professional drummers you know I often see you know when you go to see sting or like you go
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to see like U2 or something like that and you see the drummer at the back you know and you’re like they’re often like
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I don’t know 300 pound like you know afro wearing whatever and um that guy or that girl
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um Michael Jackson had a really good girl drummer for a long time they have like drum kits like onto the next venue
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like in a van right now you know like they’ve they’ve got three kids on the road and they might be doing two gigs
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you know in one day and things like this they’re just like really really disciplined
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and David has a bit of that and I just hope to get really disciplined and pass on these poems that I’ve curated over my
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life and that brings me into a mode of prayer or that ritual space you know
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because I I have trouble um accessing a meditative prayer space
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outside of music or poetry you know it’s got serious I’ve got serious issues but uh so I find
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myself writing about but I think everyone can find their mode of prayer
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outside of actively praying for someone’s philanthropy for some it’s Summits so that’s so beautiful there’s
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so many ways to pray and that’s something I’m remembering right now and cultivating in my life singing as a
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prayer poetry is a prayer um you know walking on the beach is a prayer looking at the world in a new way
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as a type of prayer so what a beautiful note to end on me Hall thank you so much for being here today
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thanks so much thanks for listening everybody it’s a real pleasure wonderful to see you take care
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[Music]
Writer Bio
Brooke Sprowl is the Founder of My LA Therapy, a concierge therapy practice, and My Truest North, a cross-disciplinary coaching and consultancy firm specializing in mission-driven entrepreneurs seeking greater integrity, spiritual awakening, and deeper ways to actualizing their higher purpose through collective service. With 15 years of clinical experience as an individual, couples, and family therapist, she is trained in a wide-range of approaches, from evidence-based therapy practices to peak performance and flow neuroscience techniques. Brooke is also the host of the podcast, Waking Up with Brooke Sprowl. She is passionate about writing, cognitive science, philosophy, integrity, spirituality, effective altruism, personal and collective healing, and curating luxury, transformational retreat experiences for people who are committed to self-discovery and using their unique gifts in service of the world.
One Response
Congratulation! I admire her so much